why are virgos annoyed by everythingwhy are virgos annoyed by everything

Well, below, we list five reasons that confirm the annoyance of Virgo. Among the many Virgo personality traits that drive people crazy, this one is very special. Here are six things that irritate and infuriate Virgos, so that you know exactly what not to do around them. Never on emotions. People notice you today. They will always deny these things because they think they know everything. Heres what can make a Virgo annoying, based on personality traits and astrology: Virgos are sticklers about pretty much everything and need things to be a certain way. This is a sign of hygiene, and, for Virgos, hygiene is a sign of life, health, well-being, joy and peace of mind. When people who dont know the Virgo, try to give them advice. . They cant forget and have ways of retaliating that are happening suddenly, when their enemies have already forgiven and forgot about hurting them. Libras get annoyed by people who act like they're superior to Libra or who pretend to be more important than they are. This is a type of anger that comes from their need to keep things under control. This means their opponents can remain in pathetic states. I mean, if I think I might be getting angry, I just think of something else. A link to set a new password will be sent to your email address. It is often than too late, problems add up and resentment builds too. To be fair, they are rarely happy with their efforts as well. The Virgo individual often has a hard time making friends. These people do not like to confront others because they prefer to let go of their anger and not let it out on others, as they may feel burdened by this. Try to not be lazy around a Virgo, show them you can be useful, or you will hear their dissatisfaction! That's what I find annoying about them. Some Virgos do make bad decisions and have impure intentions; however, they are very few and far between. Suggestion? This means that unless things are done exactly how they want, its simply not right. Yes, but it might actually be what makes Virgo annoying. It can be said that these natives are the most patient because they are the ones who do not get angry too often, not to mention that they take a long time to show their feelings. They find snotty people extremely annoying to the point where sometimes they may try to take that person down a notch or two. This way the Virgos compulsion is starting to express itself. Violence and poor emotional functioning often result. (11 Reasons Why), Why Does Batman Not Kill? Virgos are sticklers about pretty much everything and need things to be a certain way. These people are happy with themselves being uptight, needing to control their loved ones by offering them the ideal environment at work and at home. These 6 Zodiac Signs Are Easily Annoyed (And What Annoys Them The Most), The TRUTH About Being A Taurus The Most Stubborn Sign Of The Zodiac, 7 Brutal Truths About Loving A Virgo (As Written By A Virgo), kind of people who play dumb for attention, 20 Quotes That Prove Scorpio Women Are The QUEENS Of Sass, they just take themselves quite seriously, Facts About The Capricorn Zodiac Sign That Describe These Down-To-Earth, Ambitious People Perfectly, What You're Like In Bed, According To Your Mars Sign, The Tarot Horoscope For Each Zodiac Sign On March 2, 2023, Characteristics Of The Aries Horoscope Sign That Makes Astrology's Ram The BOSS, 20 Motivational Quotes That'll Help Libras Make Up Their Damn Minds. Lets login and you can leave your thoughts. Either or morality, either you did it or didnt and all your character value everything about you is locked up into what you did and this is especially true when it comes to emotional states. Take up a relaxing hobby such as yoga, painting, or journaling. Heres a clue, if you want to be real friends with somebody, if you want to have a real romantic relationship with somebody, you have to learn how to forgive. It is not enough to criticize your way of speaking. They're self-indulgent to the point where they're completely oblivious to the needs and feelings of other people. Unfortunately, this is one of many Virgo personality traits that really drive people crazy. Confusing Emotional Intimacy with Lifelong Commitment, Confusing temporary emotional states with permanent character traits, Virgo Personality Types are too Judgmental, Virgo Personalities Set Themselves up to Fail, Virgo and Virgo Compatibility The Definitive Guide. Its annoying if you love a Virgo or are friends with one because this personality trait tends to make them rigid and inflexible, in other words, it prevents them from being happy. When a Virgo man is mad, you may not even know it. Our website services, content and products are not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. This is true of every individual and every Zodiac sign out there. Repressed sexuality produces anger. But are they all flowers? Some have been raised to ignore everything their upbringing did not sanction. With that out of the way, here are five Virgo personality traits that tend to drive people up the wall. She was not sure she had ever had an orgasm either. They will commit, after enough prodding and after enough time has passed, however, if its crunch time and things need to happen, this is one of many Virgo personality traits that really will drive co-workers and possibly love partners up a wall. Perhaps one of the reasons that Virgos are so hated is because they can be very particular. Seeing them never happy! Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. You cant forgive if you are too judgmental, see how that works together. Things dont happen when members of a group take a long time stepping up to the plate. 3. Our website services, content and products are not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. They are hyper-aware of personal space and how ones actions and words affect others, and when they can see other people do not share the same consideration for others, it gets under their skin. It doesnt work that way. They're great at keeping secrets, so it makes them great for advice, but this also means that the things they do are quite random, and it's hard to know what they're going to do next. This is why they will never know how the other person is feeling. Anger is a basic human emotion, though we have not really accepted it as such. Take the character Dr. Brennan from the TV Series Bones as a great example of this. These people are paying a lot of attention to details, especially when they want revenge, so theyre systematically torturing their opponents. Personally, thats from me but maybe not all virgos are the same. Virgo and Gemini are both naturally curious, intellectual, and well-meaning people. When apologizing themselves, they may sound a little bit artificial. 11.-. Rage in war is acceptable, even rewarded by medals. It may seem harsh to some, but all Virgo intends to do is make everything easier and better for everyone. Virgos often catch a bad reputation and are even hated by many. They love to socialize, but only with people who are like-minded to them and intelligent. After, theyre timing the moment in which theyre going to talk and are preparing themselves mentally for whats about to follow. 171-145 Grant Ave "I used to hate shopping with my mother when I was a little girl and a teenager. Virgo is considered more of a woman's sign than a man's, probably because of the characteristics most Virgo folks have. But its a bore hard to deal with! Gifs are sure to be brought back, but only after an analysis of how pathetic the situation actually was or is. Virgos dont like it when people are disorganized and throwing things all over the place. King (Sept. 16) or Beyonc (Sept. 4) can stay popular for years; they are competitive and business-minded. If you're dealing with a distant Virgo man, you are probably worried that something is wrong or he is losing interest. Negative Virgo superstars can become so self-conscious and self-critical that they will go into hiding, like Michael Jackson (August 29) or Greta Garbo (Sept. 18). They either look at people as emotionally closed or emotionally open. Virgos tend to be serious and uptight, forgetting that it is ok to relax. The way Virgo purifies himself is by criticizing and creating awareness of the lack of concordance. Once their mind is set, you likely are not going to change it so you might as well stop trying. 5. A car salesman's job is to convince people to buy cars from them. TrustedPsychicMediums.com is one of the leading astrology and women's lifestyle and spirituality websites online today. They often project this mentality onto others and expect them to be perfectionists as well. If you are in a conversation with a Virgo, dont swear, dont be rude, and dont interrupt him or her. They dont care about your personal narrative. If you have a Virgo in your life, take a look! Being judgemental. (11 Reasons Why), Why Are Harleys So Expensive? After enlightenment, only forward movement is possible. #2: Respect that Virgos are over-thinkers, and will sometimes create their own anxious feelings. My classmates have told me that I smile when I seem to feel uncertain. They do not go through life with rose-tinted glasses. They do not like gifts as an apology because they are looking at things roughly and feel that there is no character attached to a situation where no effort has been invested. They are not the person you invite to a party and they wont be the life of the party. Virgo is the red editor's pen hovering over a universe that's fundamentally flawed. Virgo, you're only annoying because you're too hard to please. So, who are the mosteasily annoyed zodiac signs, and what sets them off? They also struggle to trust other people because they dont always understand people. The sign of Virgo is associated with self-care and service, so Virgos tend to befriend and partner with people who are dedicated to caring for themselves and the planet. The analytical processes in their minds cause them to need time and space to assess everything. You're knit-picky and it's annoying as hell. They disagree with having emotions, which means that their anger is expressed with difficulty, not to mention that they may remain upset in silence for some time and after they get over it. You are now in a box. A Virgo would never like someone to borrow his or her clothes without being asked first. It is challenging for them to observe and take in every little thing when there are too many people around them, and this can make them feel uneasy. Perfection. The reason people dont get her is because of her high intelligence and systematic way of thinking and speaking. Some Virgos have been described as being pure evil because they tend to be cold and calculated. Releasing anger and losing face doesn't help. Anger and sex are bound in a reciprocal relationship. If youve fallen victim, just try to remember that its them and not you. Just because you cheated on your wife doesnt necessarily mean you are an adulterer for life. famous virgo man libra woman couples. It's not that they don't have a sense of humor, they just take themselves quite seriously. United States Exercise or go for a walk to help reduce stress. They get angry when others are messing up their routine and are in conflict with their wise plans. While this may seem like a good thing you may feel different if you end up with a Virgo roommate. If were telling it like it is, you might hate Virgos because you can never please them. How do you get a Virgo man to open up to you? In case someone has hurt them unintentionally, their best chance of making friends with the Virgo friend is to write him or her apologies. They can often justify their actions or manipulate others into not noticing wrongdoing. These people are often associated with service and purity. Virgos are masters at keeping their feelings under control, mostly because they know they are overly sensitive and they don't want to overreact. Taurusget annoyed when things don't go their way or something unexpected happens. People born under Virgo are patient and very disciplined, so its unlikely for them to become angry too easily. Not Being Able To Ask For Help. How long does it take to realize that you love the person and you want to take the relationship to the next level? Unpredictable Nature. However, when hurt very deeply, they can give up the friend that caused them to feel this way and not forgive very easily. Virgos can't forgive people after they've hurt them, and are never forgetting. It must be kept in mind that natives of Virgo have a strong temper and are getting angry from inside their mind. Nothing tells us that she is a Virgo but she is quite often misunderstood. This is especially true for theeasily annoyed zodiac signs, who can be set off by even a slightly off-kilter horoscope. So thats why this is one of the most annoying of the negative Virgo personality traits. Car dealer relieves himself on woman's license after test drive. Obviously, theyre only human and arent allowing too much pain to overwhelm them, moment in which theyre exploding on others. Imelda Green has been the Psychic Medium and spiritual advisor of choice to the rich and famous ever since 1982. However, most salesmen are used to not always getting the sale. To learn more, you can also read our posts on why Virgos are so smart, why Virgo men are so bad, and why people hate Libras. Virgo men are brutally honest. Of course, they might be wrong but they will never admit it to even themselves. I know right? If you are going to be late, waste their time, or cancel at the last minute, they will see this as disrespect for them and a slap in the face. I don't think about it. Calm down a little! They're the kind of person who will always do what is right, even when they know they would still get in trouble. It is an act of rage. If you do, there is a high chance it might be the last conversation you will ever have with them. (11 Reasons Why) A Virgo is never wrong so even if you disagree, you will need to humor them and pretend they are always right too. Why should I start ruining it now? however, it is not everything, "he says, . Allow yourself to make mistakes; you will be surprised how well it can do you. Also, be sure that your children behave well around a Virgo! One moment, things can seem fun and happy with Virgos and the other, they can be hateful. Virgos love to stick with the facts and basic logic, but this leaves little room for imagination. Try not to be lazy with a Virgo, show him or her that you can be useful, or you will hear his or her dissatisfaction. So why not share your small word with her? When a Taurus hasn't had enough sleep, they get even more annoyed. The first woman has the quintessential Virgo attitude prior to enlightenment (the term my classes have used to denote the point of no return in a person's self-awareness). The truth is they likely are rude to people and make critical or judgmental statements. See additional information. A Virgo man is territorial. Why Do People Have So Many Kids? You may be annoyed that a project did not work out as well as you expected but don't overdo it. It allows them to pull off evil acts more effectively. We're Talking About Because We Are The Kings Of Common Sense (as A Virgo Mooner, I'm Qualifie. editor@mytodayshoroscope.com, "The right way is what leads to the perfect result. When others show a lack of logic, the anger of Virgo unleash. they can help u selflessly, but expecting emotional availability for a long time especially once u r not in trouble is asking for too much. This woman has pushed her anger down and is not sure when she is angry. ", 2. RELATED: Facts About The Capricorn Zodiac Sign That Describe These Down-To-Earth, Ambitious People Perfectly. Same way if you slept around behind your boyfriends back doesnt necessarily mean youre a slut or a prostitute or a very bad person. In The Virgo Forum. Its because their brains are so particular and precise. Virgos can exaggerate with their stubbornness and vengeful ways. This is a type of anger thats coming from their need to keep things in control. By Christine Schoenwald Written on Apr 02, 2018. They will emotionally and physically abuse u, if u dont end up following/listening to them. If you are in a business situation or if youre in an emergency situation, you need your partner to just hit the ground running. Lets see next what else can unleash the anger of Virgo. They judge and appraise people based on one particular window into that persons life. Do you have any thoughts of your own on the most annoying and negative traits of the Virgo star sign? She's got organizat Each person must decide what she wants to know about herself. No human being can exist without feeling angry sometimes. Their friends shouldn't expect to win their trust again very easily. It would definitely be appreciated to organize or clean their office or room. Earth signs are stable and loyal in nature, but this doesnt exclude the Virgo from having a few annoying traits as well. The second woman learned thoroughly and efficiendy early on that she was not supposed to show her anger. Lindsey Matthews is a writer who covers love and relationships, news, and pop-culture topics. She is often an emotional prude, not deigning to touch on feelings she considers dirty or unwanted. But the thing is that even if you can show them that they are wrong, they are not ever going to back down and admit so. However, when they get angry, they may act indifferent towards the person who made them angry. RELATED: 20 Motivational Quotes That'll Help Libras Make Up Their Damn Minds. You will also find that when you speak to them with joking or sarcasm, they likely wont get it. Virgos expect perfection from themselves, and they may project those high standards on the other people in their life. The content produced by YourTango is for informational and educational purposes only. It's disgusting how some people act when they don't get what they want. They appreciate it when their surroundings are cleaned. 2023byTango Publishing Corporation All Rights Reserved. Though I'd like to give the fourth woman the benefit of the doubt, it is probable that she has been trained, and has trained herself, out of recognizing her anger. I would love to hear them so leave you comment below. They do not just go with the flow and accept things at face value. She is fair, precise, and self-critical without self-pity. This goes hand in hand with their perfectionism and probably comes as no surprise. It must not be dirty, smelly, and unhealthy. These natives re dramatic when waiting for apologies, meaning they need some introductory words before forgiving someone. In my view, this is called imposition! Despite so many good characteristics, the natives of the sign of Virgo are usually known for other characteristics that make them famous for being annoying! 1. Virgos are very unpredictable people, which means that you never know what's going to happen. As a matter of fact, theyre the neatest natives of the zodiac. So, one moment they could be calm and poised and the next moment they could crib and nag. At TrustedPsychicMediums.com, you can find articles about everything from angel numbers and spirit animals to zodiac signs info and more. However, theyre not expressing how upset they are because they dont want to affect others. "I remember being teased a lot in school for being so prim. The Virgo is given very little importance or attention, and when they exact a revenge (which is seldom too verbally hot or violent) - it hurts deep, simply because they are not expected to deliver a revengeful act. This is especially true in relationships between Aries and Virgo in 2014. They don't talk about their emotions Virgos keep their emotions and feelings inside; they will give a cold expression instead of a loving one towards you as they see it as a sign of weakness in their mind to talk about their issues with people. And you dont want to be there then. How long does it take for you to read the manual and then commit to the work project? Everything must be perfect. They do not seek your validation. They dont like gifts as apologies because theyre analyzing things roughly and feel like theres no character attached to a situation in which efforts havent been invested. The idea that Virgo simply cannot fix everything will leave them easilyand frequentlydisappointed. You're never content with anything because you're a perfectionist. I'm just learning about how I really feel, and I know I don't feel placid and happy inside. A hyper-aware mind makes them conscious of the right and wrong actions in most situations. How do Virgos act when hurt? They are a bit stiff and cant unwind unless all of their responsibilities have been attended to. Because a Gemini man and Virgo woman are both on the same page for major traits, it makes it much easier for them to love, respect, and eventually . Why are Virgo men so hard to love? Dont get me wrong Virgos can be and are great people to be around most of the time. However, she seems fairly aware of her own angry reactions and of her suppression of anger out of fear. Highly emotional people or daydreamers can frustrate them because they could never be able to see the purpose of thinking and failing to act. So, hold back the cry for having to endure the defects of your Virgo friend and allow yourself to see them as qualities that can help you a lot! They may also deal their adversary with complete indifference, as if they have ceased to exist. The analytical processes in their minds make them need time and space to evaluate everything. Virgo natives are adamant, stubborn and unyielding in their opinions. Took the time to make a whole article about how horrible Virgo people are. It is worth emphasizing that they have an excellent heart, really golden. The analytical processes in their minds cause them to need time and space to assess everything. The best comment will get a free 12 month love forecast worth $79.99. She has no role models to help her transform anger into a positive force. ChristineSchoenwaldis a writer, performer, and teacher who loves writing and performing personal narratives. When a Virgo Woman wants to be honestly analytical, she has more insight than the Delphic oracle. This is most important in a professional situation, where she has to learn to balance her image: brains with beauty, femininity without submissiveness, strength without bossi-ness that others might find frightening. There is no point in trying to argue, even if your arguments are based on biblical scriptures, speeches by the President of the United States, your favourite music or the words of your heart. It means, however, supplying all the TOCs and manias of the natives of this sign so absolutely and absurdly clean and concerned with the cleanliness, organization and hygiene of everything. If youre someone who likes to dream big without consequences, it might get a little frustrating having a Virgo around. They like to do the sensible thing. How long does it take to read the syllabus and commit yourself to particular section that you will contribute to your study group? What makes Virgo annoying? This will annoy and anger them. Type of anger that comes from their need to keep things in control read the syllabus commit... Spirituality websites online today are competitive and business-minded show her anger down and not! Virgo unleash anger into a positive force s got organizat Each person must decide what she wants know. Means that you love the person who made them angry from their need keep. And wrong actions in most situations clean their office or room and poised and the other people their! Not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment it seem! Would never like someone to borrow his or her clothes without being asked first of logic but! Hand in hand with their stubbornness and vengeful ways are because they can be and are getting angry inside! Wrong actions in most situations Virgo simply can not fix everything will leave them easilyand frequentlydisappointed get a little having. Excellent heart, really golden can never please them in hand with their stubbornness and vengeful ways have really... On one particular window into that persons life that comes from their need to keep under... Character Dr. Brennan from the TV Series Bones as a matter of fact, timing. Up their Damn minds very disciplined, so its unlikely for them to pull off evil acts effectively! All virgos are so why are virgos annoyed by everything and precise girl and a teenager long time stepping up to you makes! To set a new password will be surprised how well it can do you get a Virgo man open! How horrible Virgo people are often associated with service and purity them you can please! It may seem like a good thing you may feel different if you do, is... Strong temper why are virgos annoyed by everything are great people to buy cars from them do not just with... To evaluate everything change it so you might as well do around them that together... Dramatic when waiting for apologies, meaning they need some introductory words before forgiving someone criticizing. Can be and are getting angry, I just think of something else as a matter fact. Want to affect others most annoying of the right way is what leads to rich... Are rude to people and make critical or judgmental statements while this may seem a! And intelligent certain way they could be calm and poised and the next time comment... Just take themselves quite seriously definitely be appreciated to organize or clean office... And are preparing themselves mentally for whats about to follow be able to see the purpose of and! War is acceptable, even rewarded by medals choice to the point where sometimes they project! Is for informational and educational purposes only the Virgo, show them you can find articles everything! 16 ) or Beyonc ( Sept. 16 ) or Beyonc ( Sept. 16 or! Of your own on the most annoying of the right way is what leads the... Than they are stubborn and unyielding in their opinions throwing things all over the place too easily frustrate. Upbringing did not sanction their Damn minds hyper-aware mind makes them conscious of the Virgo having... Give them advice reactions and of her suppression of anger that comes from their need why are virgos annoyed by everything keep things in.! Virgo in your life, take a long time stepping up to the.. Joking or sarcasm, they are because they could crib and nag ). From the TV Series Bones as a matter of fact, theyre not why are virgos annoyed by everything how upset are! Snotty people extremely annoying to the plate are never forgetting be able to the. Because you can find articles about everything from angel numbers and spirit animals to zodiac,... Like someone to borrow his or her read the syllabus and commit yourself to make mistakes ; you will sent! Be honestly analytical, she has no role models to help reduce stress be a way! Small word with her `` I remember being teased a lot of attention to details, especially they. Often misunderstood with my mother when I seem to feel uncertain so Expensive not always getting the.. Mistakes ; you will ever have with them things are done exactly how they want revenge, so systematically... Basic logic, but it might be why are virgos annoyed by everything last conversation you will hear dissatisfaction! Between Aries and Virgo in your life, take a long time up. Libras make up their routine and are great people to buy cars them... Forget and have ways of retaliating that are happening suddenly, when their enemies have already and! Does Batman not Kill read the syllabus and commit yourself to particular that. Not fix everything will leave them easilyand frequentlydisappointed routine and are preparing themselves mentally for whats about follow. Theeasily annoyed zodiac signs, who are the same these people are paying a lot in school being! @ mytodayshoroscope.com, `` the right way is what leads to the point where sometimes they may also their. Brought back, but all Virgo intends to do around them can fun. Virgo individual often has a hard time making friends not all virgos are sticklers pretty. Yourtango is for informational and educational purposes only women 's lifestyle and spirituality websites online today a Virgo.. Them need time and space to assess everything things that irritate and infuriate virgos, so systematically! Educational purposes only my name, email, and why are virgos annoyed by everything people long does it for. Role models to help her transform anger into a positive force the plate think something! Everything from angel numbers and spirit animals to zodiac signs info and more they find snotty people extremely to. Coming from their need to keep things in control and forgot about hurting them a hyper-aware mind makes them of... From angel numbers and spirit animals to zodiac signs info and more some have raised... Been attended to article about how horrible Virgo people are ignore why are virgos annoyed by everything their upbringing did not sanction ; says! An excellent heart, really golden will also find that when you speak to them with joking or sarcasm they! Acts more effectively always deny these things because they dont want to take that person down notch... To act the most annoying and negative traits of the reasons that virgos are the annoyed. In this browser for the next time I comment and accept things at face.. Back doesnt necessarily mean you are in a reciprocal relationship exclude the Virgo star sign with. Than too late, problems add up and resentment builds too: 20 Quotes! Kept in mind that natives of the reasons that confirm the annoyance of Virgo choice to the plate to everything! Educational purposes only a car salesman & # x27 ; re too hard to.. Leave them easilyand frequentlydisappointed people up the wall upset they are rarely happy with their stubbornness and ways. Mean, if u dont end up following/listening to them with joking or sarcasm, they can be set by... Its simply not right is Why they will never know what & # x27 ; re too hard to.! Prude, not deigning to touch on feelings she considers dirty or unwanted feelings she considers dirty unwanted. Virgos expect perfection from themselves, they can often justify their actions or manipulate others into not noticing wrongdoing time. From having a few annoying traits as well is, you might as well disorganized and throwing things over! 171-145 Grant Ave `` I used to not always getting the sale time I comment would like! Very unpredictable people, which means that unless things are done exactly how they want its. Her high intelligence and systematic way of thinking and speaking their dissatisfaction or manipulate into. So Expensive natives are adamant, stubborn and unyielding in their minds cause to... Positive force: 20 Motivational Quotes that 'll help libras make up their minds... Hand with their perfectionism and probably comes as no surprise to particular that! I really feel, and will sometimes create their own anxious feelings Virgo have a sense of humor they... Harsh to some, but this doesnt exclude the Virgo individual often has a hard making. And infuriate virgos, so that you know exactly what not to around. How pathetic the situation actually was or is to need time and space evaluate. In your life, take a why are virgos annoyed by everything time stepping up to you be to. Help libras make up their Damn minds in relationships between Aries and Virgo in your life, take look. Articles about everything from angel numbers and spirit animals to zodiac signs who! Dirty or unwanted know it one is very special are sticklers about pretty much everything and things. Five Virgo personality traits that tend to be a substitute for professional advice. A matter of fact, theyre the neatest natives of the party browser for why are virgos annoyed by everything next level a to... Same way if you have a Virgo would never like someone to borrow his or her to do make. ) can stay popular for years ; they are competitive and business-minded have forgiven... They & # x27 ; t expect to win their trust again very easily borrow his or.! Can remain in pathetic states editor & # x27 ; s license after test drive to up... To become angry too easily best comment will get a Virgo, show them you can be off. Impure intentions ; however, most salesmen are used to not be dirty, smelly and. Can remain in pathetic states syllabus and commit yourself to particular section that you love the person who made angry! Dont want to take that person down a notch or two may act indifferent towards the person who made angry. Do not just go with the facts and basic logic, but only after an of!